Increasing amounts of Pratyahara?

[CarsonZi]

Namaste All

I realized yesterday after my afternoon meditation, that there are ever increasing amounts of pratyahara happening here (I think).  Yesterday I was meditating with my wife, in our bedroom, and we were about a minute into meditation when the baby started crying in the other room. I heard my wife get up and leave the room to attend to her but that is the last thing I remember.  When I came out of meditation to check the clock, 22 minutes had past, and I realized I had been REALLY deep, as my wife was sitting on the bed beside me again and I never heard her come back into the room nor did I feel her sit down on the bed next to me.  I also realized I had been really deep because when I came out of meditation I could hear an ice cream truck directly outside the bedroom window, blaring the most gawd awful music imaginable.  Supposedly the ice cream truck had been there for quite some time, but I never heard it at all.  Just wondering....is there a chance I was sleeping?  I don't really remember much from the meditation, I don't think I was "conscious", and I don't really remember even repeating the mantra.  My inclination is to think I wasn't asleep, as I had just done a pretty intensive asana and pranayam practice and was quite awake going into meditation, but this level of "inwardness" is not common for me.  Usually there is at least some "surface level" of consciousness still there....but not this time.  I didn't hear anything, the senses were completely withdrawn from the external world.

I guess my question is, how does one know that they aren't asleep when an experience like this happens?

Love!

[riptiz]

Hi Carson,
You were probably in samadhi which I experience nearly every time I meditate.Normally when one awakes from sleep there is no mistaking it for samadhi.Samadhi for me usually results in a different awareness when I wake from it.Withdrawal of the senses as you experienced is not normally at this level with sleep alone.
L&L
Dave

[Kirtanman]

Hi Carson,

I'd go with "asleep".

Certain states of samadhi, especially when first starting out, may involve a "not sure where I've been" feeling, similar to sleep, as Riptiz describes.

Especially since (per your post, it seems - ? ) ... you're not experiencing samadhi (<- described below) regularly in meditation yet (?) -- this may have been the case (sleep-like samadhi) ... this sleep, or sleep-like dynamic is kind of the "segue" into samadhi, in my experience, and the experience of others I know, and is documented in yogic texts, as well.

The most common occurrence, when "segue-ing" into full readiness for samadhi, is to actually fall asleep. Then, bit by bit, awareness just kind of naturally remains, and you begin to remain aware, in a similar manner to spaces of inner silence when the mantra fades - but usually for longer periods of time, and with little or no body-awareness (this varies from person to person).

The next most common is to be in a sleep-like state - but to not actually have been asleep. This can usually be determined by either noting that there was some external consciousness (i.e. hearing the ice cream truck, etc.), or internal awareness - throughout, or "mostly throughout".



However, "samadhi proper", specifically nirvikalpa ("without mental constructs" - i.e. no subject, no object, no perception - awareness only) ... does involve awareness throughout.

I hope this is useful.

Wholeheartedly,

Kirtanman

[Chiron]

The baby cries, the woman runs, the man goes into pratyahara.  How typical!

[CarsonZi]

Namaste All and thanks for the input

Chiron, your post made me laugh really hard, thanks for that

Kirtanman: Ok.  So, maybe I was "asleep"!  This would be REALLY wierd for me if that's what it was though.  I've never been able to sleep sitting up, I can't sleep (nap) during the day, and I certainly am not the type of person who falls asleep quickly and for such a short period of time (20 miuntes)....especially not after rigorous physical acitivity and stimulating the internal energies with pranayama.  But, perhaps I was asleep.  It is not common for me to not have at least SOME "surface awareness", even during meditation.  I have had some meditations where I "lose myself" completely and wake up going "what day is it?  Where am I?  What was I doing?" etc etc.... but this is not what happened.  I knew where I was, what day/time it was, and that I had been (supposed to be ) meditating.  I just hadn't heard my wife re-enter the room, nor had I heard the ice cream truck outside.

So, if I WAS asleep, what would you suggest I do in order to stay more "aware" or conscious?  I wasn't dreaming, (this can happen to me in meditation sometimes), I wasn't thinking, and I wasn't (consciously) repeating the mantra.  Just wondering if there is something I can do to keep myself from sleeping during meditation.....if indeed that was what was happening.

Any input would be greatly appreciated.

Love!

[yogani]

Hi Carson:

You might want to review this lesson: http://www.aypsite.com/plus/17.html

The same situation is possible without much awareness being present, or remembered (like you had), due to to the process of inner obstructions being dissolved in deep meditation.

It is not necessary to take special measures to "stay awake," other than meditating comfortably sitting up, with or without back support. What is happening is natural, and clarity of inner awareness will return as purification and opening advance. You may or may not notice outer sensory perceptions during meditation.

In any case, we just follow the easy procedure of meditation, and when time is up we rest adequately before getting up.

The guru is in you.

PS: If you look up "sleep" in the topic index on the main website, you will find several more lessons related to this subject.

[CarsonZi]

Hi Yogani and thanks for chiming in here....had kinda hoped you would

Makes sense.

Love!

[yogani]

quote:Originally posted by CarsonZi

Hi Yogani and thanks for chiming in here....had kinda hoped you would

I'm quite familiar with Lesson 17 (and I just read it again) as it is part of the AYP Level 1 lessons in the hands-on AYP classes.  This sentence here:
"No sensory experience, no mantra, no thoughts, but still conscious inside – were you asleep? Probably not." almost applies to my situation except for the line about still being "conscious inside".... I had no sensory experience, no mantra, no thoughts, but I wasn't seemingly "conscious".

Does that change the reality of whether or not I was sleeping?

Love!

Hi Carson:

That's why this line was added above:
 

quote:The same situation is possible without much awareness being present, or remembered (like you had), due to to the process of inner obstructions being dissolved in deep meditation.

Yes, it can happen like that and not be "sleep" in the normal sense. But it is a normal experience that can happen in deep meditation to one degree or other. It is deep purification going on, with a temporary loss of awareness.

A word to describe this kind of experience in meditation is "blackout." It is distinctly different from regular sleep, and is a direct result of deep meditation. I prefer not to use that word much, because it may be misinterpreted in some way. But that is essentially what it is. It is part of the journey of purification and opening, and like all experiences (or lack of them), it will pass as new openings occur.

We just keep on favoring the procedure of practice, and it all passes by and opens up in the light of pure bliss consciousness.

The guru is in you.

[CarsonZi]

Hi Yogani

Yeah, I edited my above post because I realized (after re-reading your post a few times) what you had meant.  

Thanks for clarifying though...much appreciated.

Love!

[riptiz]

Hi Carson,
I have experienced this stae of nothing sat up on a normal chair like you would find in a canteen or cafe. I was sitting to meditate and when I came round I was sat bolt upright, my back was not resting on the chair back and it felt like I had an iron bar running down my spine keeping me upright.If that's being asleep I'll take that anytime. LOL
L&L
Dave