Kundalini rising in 30 days

[riptiz]

Hi Alvin,
Kundalini can be awakened instantly by shaktipat but as stated before this is only a starting point.Using other methods may or may not result in awakening of the shakti and may take many years.
Albert, KMY has all one needs to make swift progress as well as shaktipat.My sadguru was originally a high level tantric yogi before meeting his guru DhyanyogiMadhusudandasji and receiving shaktipat.He states that KMY is a faster and more efficient method on the path to enlightenment.
L&L
Dave

[Tibetan_Ice]

quote:Originally posted by Nirodha

Hi TI,

You're welcome.

Kundalini seems to be always flowing within me now. I'm not sure how to describe it exactly: It's as if I have a belly full of pulsating joy throughout my day. When I meditate and reach Samadhi (meditative absorption) it will eventually migrate up my back and torso and be most prominently felt in my head.

In regards to bringing Kundalini up at will: That's not something I even think about, as I don't try to manipulate it at all. I just meditate sensitive to joy and pleasure (samadhi factors) and it arises on it's on.

Hi Nirodha,
  But isn't performing the mulabandha (root lock) or most of the other exercises a form of indirectly manipulating the kundalini?

 What I am trying to understand is this: If I do the root lock, I get heat rising up my spine and into my head. If I do kumbhaka, I get more heat. If I sneeze, I get heat in my head. If I laugh, my whole face gets hot. When I meditate, do spinal breathing or just slow my breath down, I get heat. What is going on here? Am I raising chi, a combination of prana/apana, psychic heat, or am I raising a little of the kundalini each time?

 If Bhajan's article, he says that mixing of prana and apana cause psychic heat and that this heat can be used to awaken the kundalini. (is this chi, qi, etc?)  So, now I'm thinking everyone is misinterpreting heat to be kundalini. How can this be? Are both the psychic heat and kundalini hot, so you can't tell the difference?


TI

[selfonlypath]

Hi TI,

I've just read the article you indicated at the beginning of your thread plus your last post to Nirodha.

You might find interesting to read the approach of two other lineages regarding your question:
http://www.eng.vedanta.ru/library/kundalini_tantra/2_manipura_chakra.php
then gTummo
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six_yogas_of_Naropa

Both yogas (hindu type and tibetan type) imply that psychic heat is just one step that will be followed by much more difficult yogas (six yogas of Naropa) to reach enlightment so I feel it contradicts 3HO teachings:
http://www.whale.to/v/kundalini.html

Tibetan schools already consider gTummo a very difficult yoga to practice and mention it is very dangerous to practice such yoga without an authentic master so it is not that simple as 3HO says.

This video gives a glimpse of gTummo or psychic heat generation:
http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=_zBNHGWMju0

Hopes this helps you, Albert

[Nirodha]

quote:Originally posted by Tibetan_Ice

Hi Nirodha,
  But isn't performing the mulabandha (root lock) or most of the other exercises a form of indirectly manipulating the kundalini?

TI

Hi TI,

I don't practice Hatha Yoga, so I can't answer your questions related to it. My vague understanding of Asanas, which come from Hatha Yoga, is that they're to used to teach poise, balance & strength. And, are practiced to improve the body's physical health and clear the mind in preparation for meditation.

Questions regarding life force and energy theories, as such chi, qi and prana, I can't answer either, as these aren't directly addressed within the framework I use - at least not to my knowledge. And, since it's working quite well for me, I don't explore outside of it much as I don't have a need to.

I've experienced psychic heat related issues though; mild burning sensations; giving off an excess of body heat, etc.. However, since it just comes and goes of it's own accord, without causing me any major discomfort, I've not had a need to attempt to manipulate it. If I was having trouble with it though perhaps I might.

From my point of view, my Kundalini Awakening was just a byproduct, or fruit, of my diligently practicing the framework I adhere to, and frequently dwelling in Samadhi as a result of that. The framework I adhere to is called Nikayan Buddhism.

The word Nikayan refers to pre-sectarian Buddhism, as defined in the earliest Nikaya (Collection) portions of the Sutta Pitaka (Discourse Basket) of the Pali Canon. And, the Pali Canon is generally considered by scholars to be the oldest extant record of what the Buddha taught.

Nikayan Buddhism uses a lot of the same Suttas as classical Theravada Buddhism for it's doctrinal basis. However, the two differ greatly in their interpretation of these and in their points of view. Some of the major points of difference are:

1.) Nikayan rejects the emphasis on commentarial writings that classical Theravada relies so heavily upon for framing their interpretation of the Suttas. And, takes the Suttas at face value instead.

2.) It also rejects the classical Theravadin view that developing Vipassana (Insight or Intuitive Wisdom) is the primary mode of bringing the Noble Eightfold Path to fruition.

3.) Nikayan proposes that of the development of Samadhi, all the way to Nirodha-Samapatti (Cessation of Perception and Feeling), is the primary mode for fruition.

4.) It also views Vipassana as a byproduct, or fruit, of Samadhi. And, not as some separate practice strategy the way classical Theravada does.

Nikayan Buddhism doesn't address the issue of Kundalini directly, as the word appears to post-date the Buddha. However, some have proposed that it's addressed indirectly within the framework. Please review the following essay for more information on this issue:

Kundalini - Understanding the Charismatic Experience by Jhanananda

http://www.greatwesternvehicle.org/kundalini.htm

By the way, I'm not trying to convert you to Nikayan Buddhism. I'm merely explaining my background, and point of view, so that we can come to some mutual understanding. Also, there are a lot of parallels between Raja Yoga, of which some AYP lessons are based on, and Nikayan Buddhism. This being the main reason I'm here.

Kind regards

[Tibetan_Ice]

Hi Nirohda
First off, please let me say. I am proud to be corresponding with you and I thank you for your essay! I tingled most of the way through it.  Thank you!

The one concept that stood out for me was this one:

quote:Originally posted by Nirodha
From your essay:
"These case histories also reveal that the kundalini rises on its own in its fast mode once one enters the 4th stage of meditative absorption. Thus we have found it is completely unnecessary to "open" the chakras and "raise" the kundalini, as if they were separate functions from meditative absorption (jhana/samadhi).  In fact to think one can do those things through willing them through practicing a cognitive meditation practice is completely erroneous thinking and only reveals a complete lack of understanding of the process of spiritual awakening.

My question is this: Is it possible that, even if chakras are unnecessary, by spending 1/2 hour on activating them through intense concentration and willpower, might this not produce the 4'th stage of meditative absorption?
 I do recall, many years ago, when I made a tremendous effort by performing a levitation meditation every day for 1 hour for 30 days in a row, that consistently, after 20 minutes of intense concentration, my body would dissolve and there would appear an "upside-down waterfall" in the center of my neck rising upwards to the crown, pulling me upwards. I never did succeed in levitating, but I'm sure I hit samadhi consistently every day after 20 minutes.

With great respect
TI

[Tibetan_Ice]

quote:Originally posted by selfonlypath

Hi TI,

I've just read the article you indicated at the beginning of your thread plus your last post to Nirodha.

You might find interesting to read the approach of two other lineages regarding your question:
http://www.eng.vedanta.ru/library/kundalini_tantra/2_manipura_chakra.php
then gTummo
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six_yogas_of_Naropa

Both yogas (hindu type and tibetan type) imply that psychic heat is just one step that will be followed by much more difficult yogas (six yogas of Naropa) to reach enlightment so I feel it contradicts 3HO teachings:
http://www.whale.to/v/kundalini.html

Tibetan schools already consider gTummo a very difficult yoga to practice and mention it is very dangerous to practice such yoga without an authentic master so it is not that simple as 3HO says.

This video gives a glimpse of gTummo or psychic heat generation:
http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=_zBNHGWMju0

Hopes this helps you, Albert

Hi Albert,
  Thank you very much for the links and information. You know, I've seen that same video on youtube before. At the time, I thought that it seemed like there was a lot of effort being put into generating heat. I guess I had envisioned someone just sitting there quietly, breathing quietly, steaming away, but I enjoyed watching the video again just the same.

 The view that kundalini rises from the manipura chakra is unconventional. First time I hear of that view. It is certainly not the order of awakening chakras as described in the Translation of the B Gita by Yogananda. There are many different schools of thought out there. Kundalini is getting to be as popular as the Beatles!

 Yes, the 3H0 teachings seem to be oversimplified. One thing that intrigued me was Yogi Bhajan's statement about how yogis learned to store prana in their abdomens and live off of it. Today, I received a book that I had ordered called "Qigong Meditation - Small Circulation" by Dr. Yang, Jwing-Ming. It is an excellent book which contains very clear and precise instructions on how to generate and store chi. I tried the reverse breathing for 5 minutes and for the first time in my life, the area below my navel got very hot. (I'm probably going to regret that because my face has been feeling burnt for the last two hours.. time to eat some yogurt..)
Perhaps this is the method that Yogi Bhajan speaks about but never elucidates?


Again, thanks for you input
TI

[Nirodha]

quote:Originally posted by Tibetan_Ice
My question is this: Is it possible that, even if chakras are unnecessary, by spending 1/2 hour on activating them through intense concentration and willpower, might this not produce the 4'th stage of meditative absorption?

I do recall, many years ago, when I made a tremendous effort by performing a levitation meditation every day for 1 hour for 30 days in a row, that consistently, after 20 minutes of intense concentration, my body would dissolve and there would appear an "upside-down waterfall" in the center of my neck rising upwards to the crown, pulling me upwards. I never did succeed in levitating, but I'm sure I hit samadhi consistently every day after 20 minutes.

Hi TI,

You're welcome. And, I'm glad you're finding my input useful. While I can appreciate your pride in corresponding with me, it's really not necessary, as I'm just another person.

In my opinion, and from my experience, spending a half an hour intensely concentrating, and forcefully willing something to arise, will only result in anxiety and a tension headache in the short term. And, serious psychophysical problems in the long term, if one continues down such a course of action.

You may be using the word 'concentration' in a different manner than I do though. Perhaps what you are referring to is the act of maintaining relaxed attention to one's object of meditation.

Meditative Absorption, and it's associated phenomena (e.g. Chakra openings, Kundalini arisings, etc.), don't arise through some volitional act on the part of the yogi - at least not from my perspective. I've found that these things only arise when one relinquishes their mind and body to varying degrees. And, through this relinquishing, one can reach any stage of Samadhi they wish in due time.

Regarding your experience: Yes, it's sounds like Samadhi to me. And, I've also experienced such phenomena during meditation.

Being able to reach Samadhi within 20 minutes is indeed possible. And, I know of people that can reach it within 1 minute of sitting down to meditate - myself included.

If I recall correctly, in Patanjali's Yoga Sutras he divides Samadhi into three levels: Laya Samadhi, Savikalpa Samadhi and Nirvikalpa Samadhi.

However, in Nikayan Buddhism Samadhi is divided into eight levels: First Jhana, Second Jhana, Third Jhana and Fourth Jhana designate  progressive levels of absorption in which one still has access to their physical senses. And, First Ayatana (Dimension or Plane), Second Ayatana, Third Ayatana and Fourth Ayatana designate progressive levels of absorption in which one's physical senses have been effaced.
 
Therefore, if you felt your body dissolve, I think it's a pretty safe bet to say that you reached the level of Ayatana.

Kind regards

[selfonlypath]

quote:Originally posted by Tibetan_Ice
 The view that kundalini rises from the manipura chakra is unconventional. First time I hear of that view. It is certainly not the order of awakening chakras as described in the Translation of the B Gita by Yogananda. There are many different schools of thought out there.

Hey TI,

You might find extra information on the beginning of this thread:
http://www.aypsite.com/plus-forum/index.php?topic=3324

Also look on this excellent thread:
http://www.aypsite.com/plus-forum/index.php?topic=2516

Albert

[Tibetan_Ice]

quote:Originally posted by selfonlypath

You might find extra information on the beginning of this thread:
http://www.aypsite.com/plus-forum/index.php?topic=3324

Also look on this excellent thread:
http://www.aypsite.com/plus-forum/index.php?topic=2516

Albert

Hi Albert
 Thanks for the excellent links. I believe I read them a while ago but rereading them with a little more experience is always a bonus.
 I must admit, though, I'm not entirely clear on how kadak says to drip the white drop. Does that mean opening the crown chakra, melting it into white liquid light and then taking it down to the root through the sushumna?

 I found this statement by kadak which really resonates with me:
"Because bliss opens the central channel, and AYP techniques are effective for bliss."

 Bliss! As in religious bliss? Or bhakti? Or positive emotions? Love? Worship? Desire to be with God? Sending love to God? Opening the heart? Hmmm.

Is bliss another way to drip the white drops?


TI

[selfonlypath]

quote:Originally posted by Tibetan_Ice
 I must admit, though, I'm not entirely clear on how kadak says to drip the white drop. Does that mean opening the crown chakra, melting it into white liquid light and then taking it down to the root through the sushumna?

Hello TI,

Look at this way: human vessel is made of 6 elements which are earth, water, fire, air, channels and drops. There are red drops, white drops and the indestructible drop.

P.S. Some system speak of 5 elements by regrouping channels and drop inside the element space.

Before engaging in white drop dripping which is dangerous and corresponds to dissolving the winds into CC through crown chakra gate, tummo requires first to fire up red drops via dissolving the winds into CC through navel chakra gate. Then inner heat or psychic heat generated in navel will go up and make drip white drops from crown chakra to amp-up the process.

Please note that 3HO does precisely this at the beginning: drawing apana and prana at navel chakra is equivalent to start tibetan tummo yoga but after, 3HO dangerously diverges from full tummo practice.

 

quote:I found this statement by kadak which really resonates with me:
"Because bliss opens the central channel, and AYP techniques are effective for bliss."

Yes Bliss is important for this but always remember what authentic lama mention: cut attachment to bliss.

Albert

[threearrows]

I would really appreciate some help in understanding the article that was linked to in the original post.

Has anyone tried this method?  Or could someone please at least clarify it a little?  The article is not entirely clear, and the method of which he (seems) to be speaking isn't even really described entirely, or seems to be at odds with itself:

At first he seems to make it clear:

 

quote:  
1. Mulbandh brings apana, eliminating force, to the navel or fourth vertebra, the central seat of the Kundalini.
2. Diaphragm lock takes it up to the neck.
3. Neck lock takes it up all the rest of the way.

Sounds simple enough, but after that things get convoluted:

 

quote:All it is, is creating the prana in that cavity, and mixing it with apana, and taking it down (as we give pressure to the oil), and bringing the oil up is Kundalini.

The first quote seems to imply raising, but here -- you first mix and then take it down?

And then:

 

quote:We know certain actions through which we inhale with this pranic energy, and when we inhale with this pranic energy, our pranic centre gets awakened.

Does anyone know of which actions he speaks?

 

quote:[...] We call it "U" muscle, because it is shaped like the letter "U" and this "U" muscle [...] This is what they do. They make the cavity active with certain exercises; and thus, they know how to control the pranic energy or prana-vayu, the life current. That’s one part of it.

Again, does anyone have an idea what these are?

 

quote:The second is apana, which eliminates everything. It is where the Kundalini power lives. Now, when the pranic energy is in you, then the second part is that you can circulate it through your body. You can feel it and make people feel it; we teach people how to do it. It is a scientific thing that has got nothing to do with mystics, or something which I can’t explain. It is so simple, it is practical, and so we circulate it.

Circulate it how?

 

quote:In the circulation we time it to go with the spinal cord. Then we make it hit the Muladhara. Thus we pierce through that bind or blockage before the Kundalini power. The moment we do it, she has no option but to come up, and the moment she comes up, you stand blessed.

So the first time he implied you raise the energy, the second time that you lower the energy from the navel then raise it, the third time it sounds like you just blast a hole through your root and let her take you.  It's not clear which one of these is the core method.

So can anyone help out here and clarify?  I'd at least like to know what he's talking about.

Thanks,
James