Can someone shed some light on Kaya Kalpa?

[david_obsidian]

Yogani said:
On the other hand, if you have made a promise to keep a secret, then you are bound by your promise, of course.

On the other hand,  I have made promises I no longer feel morally bound to keep.  An example is a promise I made when I was 18 years old,  to the TM organization not to reveal anything about the technique they taught me.  As I see it now,  I made the promise under false understandings,  many of those false understandings cultivated by those who required the promise.

[yogani]

quote:Originally posted by david_obsidian

Yogani said:
On the other hand, if you have made a promise to keep a secret, then you are bound by your promise, of course.

On the other hand,  I have made promises I no longer feel morally bound to keep.  An example is a promise I made when I was 18 years old,  to the TM organization not to reveal anything about the technique they taught me.  As I see it now,  I made the promise under false understandings,  many of those false understandings cultivated by those who required the promise.

Hi David:

Okay, then how about: "...if you have made a promise to keep a secret, and feel obligated to keep it, it will be respected, of course. On the other hand, if you don't, then fire away! We can make good use of the information..."

The guru is in you.

[Shanti]

quote:Originally posted by yogani

quote:Originally posted by Athma_Shakti

...for many reasons i cannot tell the technique (of kaya kalpa) here, because it may be unsafe if its done without the guru.

Hi Kumar:

This has been said in the past about many of the practices in AYP, and we have found that with good instructions (including self-pacing), the warnings have been unfounded and untrue. In fact, there has been much more progress by many with open availability of knowledge on practices, and fewer mishaps because of the open availability -- meaning, good information on dealing with excesses and pitfalls, which is an ongoing development of information based on the causes and effects in thousands of practitioners.

Conversely, secret teachings tend to be static, and have led to guesswork and poor application of practices by eager self-directed practitioners -- resulting in more mishaps and less progress. This is what we have learned over the past 40 years. With so many stepping up to take on practices of all kinds, the need for better information on all practices is great. Times are changing.

I have been thinking about this for a few days.. even before you posted this Kumar... before AYP, I had read about Kechari mudra (cannot remember where), but it came with a warning, it could be done only under supervision of a guru, else you could lose your speech. That scared me away from even the thought of ever trying it.. Not sure why anyone would say this, I don't think anyone here has had any trouble with speech.. have they? It has been one of the easier mudras to perform with self pacing and has brought about the biggest changes in my practice.

[Athma_Shakti]

Dear Yogani

I will mail you regarding this

[Athma_Shakti]

"kundalini yoga" is a course i learned from a group called "valga valamudan" its in southern part of India. founded by the great
"vethathiri maharishi".

http://www.vethathiri.org
this is the website for this organisation.

http://www.vethathiri.org/skycenter/
this link will take you to find different centres available in different countries

http://www.vethathiri.org/courses/kayakalpa
know about the benefits of kaya kalpa yoga

i feel that its better to learn from a qualified person, a person can see fire, but that person cannot feel that he has to touch it.

well i want to say something about this "secret" "promise" "respect"
that i want to share with you. try to understand my english LOL.
iam also a person don't like secrets, i want to know everything behind the scenes and thats the nature of every human being. i wondered why peoples keep things secret and why God keeps things secret. to be honest i got the answer for this when i faced the situation here myself.

we can see that everything in this creation has a form and its organised. electrons bound to nucleus to make an atom. and atoms bound together and organised to give a material form, solar systems, galaxies etc.. and there is a force helps in binding it together to make organisation. even in society there are organisations schools, colleges, industries, government, military etc..

ok what these things related to secret, promise and respect?

for example science is a knowledge, using this knowledge we can create technology like computers, aircrafts etc... also we can create destruction. and if we didn't learn the knowledge properly from proper organisations like colleges and universities, then huge risk, it will cost many lives. knowledge is not belong to anyone, its God and its there, we have to tune in ourselves to receive it, one of the example for that is "vethathiri maharishi". after that the knowledge is organised and given so that even normal persons can understand it. this organised can be yoga schools, or like this AYP site or in any organised form.

we can say that this knowledge of science is a secret. but its not the meaning that it won't be available to anyone, the meaning of secret is it will be available in a organised way, and we respect for that. and there are many levels of secrets. the meaning of respect is love. peoples think respect means fear to someone. i respect my Guru, Yogani, everyone here, that doesn't mean i fear, its a kind of love to show all. everyone know that fear is the blockage for realization.

ok now think on the other way of secret, if there is no secret that
means no organisations, no schools, colleges, universities, governments will not exist, because everyone can do everything on their own. but whats wrong about this?, everyone should know everything and thats a good thing. but i think it will take time for the human civilization to reach that level of evolution. because for peoples really interested in knowledge they can learn on their own way, what for others who cannot? and what for peoples are trying to create destruction out of scientific knowledge?

what is promise? why should i make promise to my Guru that i will not tell the techniques to anyone? and why should i keep this promise?  promise will bound you for not to tell it. that means promise defines boundary for an organisation. every form has a boundary like objects, atoms etc.. which makes it finite in space, otherwise it becomes infinite or boundariless. so the knowledge is available to everyone in a organised with specific boundaries.
why the governments hide many secrets from public, why its not
published in newspapers. even this AYP website is well organised with boundaries, its prohibited to duplicate the site or the books. why because peoples can duplicate and make lot of money and there will be errors in duplication and it won't be the same. then there will not have any value or respect for Yogani's hard work. and these days its happening in many organisations even in this kundalini yoga, its becoming business in many places and quality is losing.

well its easy to say i don't respect anyone, that means we don't
respect God, because everything is God. there are many false promises are broken and also true promises are broken. when peoples marry promise to stay together, but sometimes its broken.
if the student don't respect the teacher, the army man don't respect
his commander, children don't respect their parents, peoples don't
respect their relationships, then humanity will be lost, love will be lost and organisation will break.

regarding kaya kalpa it takes 3 minutes to learn the technique, this organisation welcomes all and all the tehcniques are available its not hidden, but we have to do small work, we have to approach the place, like we are approaching this AYP site and reading the lessons.

knowledge has to be availabe to everyone, if its difficult to approach this place, then pls contact Yogani.

i apologise if i said anything wrong in my post. i don't mean to hurt or argue with anyone, i just write whats in my mind.


Thanx for reading this post
Love you all
Kumar

[yogani]

Hi Kumar:

Well said, and thank you for sharing.

Of course, it remains to be seen whether the open source approach in AYP will stand the test of time, and none of us should take the ancient traditional approaches too lightly. Collectively, they are the foundation of all current spiritual progress in the world.

Meanwhile, we have a planet full of people who need practical spiritual knowledge which cannot be served in total using the traditional methods of knowledge transmission, so we continue to press for a solution.

Thank goodness for the internet.

The guru is in you.

[Doc]

Namaste to All!

I have often wondered why so many people are so willing to believe that the key to great achievements in yoga sadhana is to learn some 'secret training method', or to ingest some 'magical elixir'? Wow, wouldn't that be great? What a novel concept.  Just imagine it....a 'siddhi secret' or a 'samadhi shortcut'! Think of all the meditation and practice time saved, and all the years of disciplined effort.

Getting back to the real world, however, it has been my observation that those who perpetuate a consistently self-disciplined Yoga Sadhana, and practice seriously on a daily basis, generally maintain a much more youthful body and mind than those who do not engage in such practices. Such yogis and yoginis usually look decades younger than their actual chronological age, and demonstrate the ability to extend their life well beyond the normal range of life expectancy.  

As a case in point, my own Guru looked to be perhaps 30 years of age when already past 70 years old, and never looked as old as his actual age even at the elderly end of his life, a life that he chose to leave even though he was in excellent health, and probably could have lived on indefinitely if he had wanted to do so.

And it's not only the Yoga practitioners who demonstrate such accomplishments. My primary teacher in the Chinese Internal Arts is now 106 years of age, and could easily pass for a man in his 50's!  By my reckoning, if a person looks but half their actual age, then they've only lived half of their life thus far, should they choose to continue on that long! He has maintained a very youthful body, and has acquired knowledge and skills that eclipsed those of his contemporaries, and have inspired several generations of practitioners thereafter. I can't say that this translates into physical immortality (kaya kalpa), but it's the closest contact with the possibility of it that I have personally encountered.

There is nothing secret, or particularly mystical and magical, about such demonstrations of personal achievement. It was and is simply the result of long-term, dedicated effort...constantly learning, studying, and practicing authentic, traditional training methods. Such personal efforts may seem unattainable, even magical, to many folks merely because they are unwilling to sufficiently discipline themselves in order to duplicate similar accomplishments.

http://www.horusmedia.de/1999-schlangen/alex_grey.jpg

Hari OM!

Doc

[Scott]

Great post, Doc.

[Doc]

Thanks, Scott!

Your question in an earlier post as to why anyone would seek Immortality, got me thinking that perhaps sometimes it's not something one deliberately pursues.  Instead, maybe a natural extension of life, even indefinitely, without a time limit, is a sort of 'perk' or extra reward for living life well, for always seeing and experiencing ever greater Union with the Immutable, Immortal Divine Self present in All.  And perhaps this is natural outcome of a Sadhana that is constantly striving to learn more, to understand more, to accomplish more, without ever feeling as if the living is done yet. You know..."don't stop me now, man, I'm on a roll!" And so life just keeps going and going and going...like the EverReady Energizer Bunny on TV. Maybe a large part of ordinary 'mortality' is simply the wish to be done with it all.

http://www.horusmedia.de/1999-schlangen/alex_grey.jpg

Hari OM!

Doc

[Athma_Shakti]

before i joining this kundalini yoga, i was planning to join another course, and i requested twice but didn't got reply from them, may be i was not prepared then?. later i joined this kundalini yoga but i found totally different techniques. certain techniques i learned here in this AYP site

secret has is own advantages and disadvantages and sometimes it will be annoying if we don't get the right thing on right time. may be the saying "when we are ready the knowledge will be available to us" is true.

magik and siddhis - patanjali yoga sutras says that, we should not show interest on siddhis. i think siddhis give us a chance to explore our various abilities, i think its a window of freedom given by God to explore his Creation, and we can use it in proper way.

sometimes kaya kalpa is also seen as type of magik, but its a yoga technique which invovles some action mainly pranayama and working with crown.

i heard some herbs and vibrations also brings some miraculous powers.

when i was in school years, i was doing some exercises on my own to fly physically. i used to put pillows on the floor jump and fall down, but i was doing it seriously LOL, one day i was doing the same practice in my dreams, when i jumped my body became light and finally i was flying all over the place that was wonderfull. after that i was able to fly in my dreams, but not physically yet LOL.

[Doc]

quote:Originally posted by Athma_Shakti

mantra meditation, pranayama and other techniques also can bring good health, but the "kaya kalpa" technique does it directly, its a kind of spreading the divine energy to our entire body, like we take bath to clean our body. Kumar

Namaste to All!

I have to take exception to this statement, since it essentially implies that other methods of mantra japa, meditation, and pranayama, as normally taught and practiced, do not directly produce good health....but states that only the secret, proprietary 'kaya kalpa' method has a direct effect. I admit that I am not specifically a 'kaya kalpa' practitioner.  I am merely a simple yogi sadhaka who has practiced the very open and accessible Ramakrishna Universal Yoga method earnestly on a daily basis since 1966.

From the outset, my health, strength, flexibility, balance, body control, mind control, and so forth, directly and immediately improved, resulting in fewer bouts of head colds, flu, allergies, indigestion, and the like. Within two years time of commencing the practices, I no longer had any illnesses at all.  My last internal illness of any kind was a head cold in October of 1967!  Other than the occaisional cut, burn, or bruise, all stemming from external injuries, I have been illness-free for nearly 40 years time to date....all without the supposedly magical benefits of secret 'kaya kalpa' herbal formulations and/or training methods. So what's not to like about standard yoga practices[?]  

Given the self-discipline to establish and maintain a serious Sadhana, I don't really perceive the need for anything else.  This is only my humble opinion. I honor each person's right to select and practice whatever methods they feel are best for them.

http://www.geocities.com/rkmvaranasi/logo.jpg

Hari OM!

Doc

[Athma_Shakti]

Hi doc

i heard of Ramakrishna Universal Yoga Method, i don't know what practice they do, i think they practice on bakhti yoga?

i also read the seven volumes of Swami Vivekananda, it contains wonderful informations.

can you describe us here what kind of practice you do with your guru?

just curious to know about various techniques.

Thanx
Kumar

[Doc]

Namaste Kumar!

The Ramakrishna Universal Yoga Method as taught to me by my Guru, the late Sri Swami Narayanananda, formerly of Rishikesh, Himalayas, India, is a complete Ashtanga Yoga System, but with special emphasis on four of the Eight Limbs. Swami Narayanananda was the top Disciple of Sri Ramakrisna's #2 Disciple, Sri Swami Shivananda, who founded the Ramakrishna Math after Sri Ramakrishna's death.

http://www.geocities.com/divinecities/Ramakrishna.jpg
 
The writings and teachings of Sri Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa Deva, especially the 'The Gospel of Ramakrishna', heavily influence the spiritual philosophy of the Sadhana.  Below are a few links to a free e-book translation of this powerful book, and to other information about the method as a whole.

http://www.ramakrishnavivekananda.info/
http://www.ramakrishna.org/c_teach.htm
http://www.ramakrishna.org/emblem.htm

Hare OM!

Doc